Once a Baby-Killer…
Once a Baby-Killer…
For some reason, pro-life Christians think their God is against abortion and baby-killing. I don’t get it! There are lots of examples to the contrary in the Bible. I mean, who has killed more babies than the Christian God? Have you read these passages?
Hosea 13:16 Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up.
Exodus 12:29 “And it came to pass, that at midnight the LORD smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt…”
2 Samuel 12:14 Howbeit, because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, the child also that is born unto thee shall surely die.
Isaiah 13:16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled, and their wives ravished.
Isaiah 13:18 Their bows also shall dash the young men to pieces; and they shall have no pity on the fruit of the womb; their eyes shall not spare children.
Isaiah 14:21 Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.
Numbers 31:17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
I ask you… How can Christians carry that book around and swear by it’s contents, but have absolutely no fucking idea what it says? Amazing!!!
You’ve got the characters backward. The clean-cut guy with the tie is the Christian. The skinhead with the diabolical beard is the wicked pro-abortion Hell-rotter.
;-)
I have read these things. In my view, God is the only one who can judge truthfully. Some of these passages you have little context on whats being said. In Egypt God was sending a plague so terrible pharaoh would surly let Israel go free. Egypt was very very proud, this is evident in what else, the pyramids. Egypt did not want to get off there lazy rear ends and build there own monuments. Also, seeing as Egypt was so proud, if they would have let there slaves go they would loose there rep. If Egypt would have let Israel go the Pharaoh would have looked less godlike thus threatening his supremacy.
If you could not see something so simple as God having to send Death in this form to Egypt there is no hope of you understanding the other passages.
People like mikespeir give people like me a bad name. I don’t think he understands any more that most of you guys.
I’d say your both retarded. I’ll put money on that statement as well.
Must be, Andre, because I don’t have a clue where either of you are trying to go with this.
I’d say mikespeir is being sarcastic. I’ll put money on that statement as well.
Amazing band.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xu9ZQtzKeik
Song title says it all.
Thanks for showing me this Greenworld. Tell me if I’m wrong but I think this just fuel to the fire. I understand what they are talking about (after reading the lyrics). This made me sad how warped i have seen things get. One representing the other perceiving, both warped. Twisted. Me. You. Him. Her. They.Us.All… There is still hope my friend. Things are about to change….
Don’t take it personally. I just found it interesting that you’d capitalize that word. And “Lack of Comprehension” was aimed at you for your lack of comprehension of, well, your Bible. Instead of seeing it for what it truly is, you (just like any other believer) like to use metaphors to make up for some of the most evil acts carried by your god. And not just that, but other believers have their own metaphors, which may or may not be the same as yours. That’s a problem, because you’re all twisting the meaning of the verses and applying them into your own way of interpretation. A skeptical and literal point of view is the intelligent way to go, not using your emotions and “personal experiences” to try and understand a cruel and petty god such as Yahweh. Most Christians like to avoid the Old Testament or simply pass it off as just something that happened only in those times, that since Jesus’ arrival there is no need to live life the Old Testament way. Sorry, but I disagree with this view; Jesus said that he came to fulfill his father’s laws, not abolish them. Therefore, either live your life the Old Testament and New Testament way or don’t live either of them at all. If a Christian is going to dismiss Old Testament laws yet continue to attack and ridicule homosexuals for being born with a sexuality not understood by them then that’s just sad. Cherry picking verses does not make you a true and genuine believer. Either believe it 100% of the time or ditch it.
Let’s take a look see at what kind of silliness Casey is spewing, shall we?
>> I have read these things. In my view, God is the only one who can judge truthfully.
What do you base this on? As stated, a little context goes a long way. Do you know that Jesus loves you so simply because the bible tells you so…or do you have some other basis for that belief?
>> Some of these passages you have little context on whats being said.
Okay, then explain under what context “their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up” becomes an acceptable thing for anyone to say?
>> In Egypt God was sending a plague so terrible pharaoh would surly let Israel go free.
Exo 14:8 “The LORD hardened the heart of Pharaoh king of Egypt, so that he pursued the Israelites, who were marching out boldly.” In other words, the Judeo-Christian god sent Moses into the Pharoah’s palace to plead mercy and release for his people…and that same god made the Pharaoh say no. And when Pharaoh agreed to let the people go, their god then changed the mind of Pharoah so that he would persue the Jews. And, why would he do such a thing?
Exo 14:17-18 “I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians so that they will go in after them. And I will gain glory through Pharaoh and all his army”.
I’m reminded of Stuart on MadTV…”Look at I can do!!” That’s right, he did it for no other reason than to be a dick and make himself look tough. Your god is a douche so big he wouldn’t even be welcomed on “The Jersey Shore”.
>> Egypt was very very proud, this is evident in what else, the pyramids. Egypt did not want to get off there lazy rear ends and build there own monuments.
Yuh-huh…except, the pyramids weren’t actually built by slaves, let alone Jewish ones. Excavations of the sites shows not only were most of the people hauling the stones willing participants, they took pride in the work they were doing. After all, they were building the tomb of a god, and we know how any religion can convince the mindless masses to do stupid things.
>> If Egypt would have let Israel go the Pharaoh would have looked less godlike thus threatening his supremacy.
And yet, he did….or, didn’t. See, there’s only ONE known written record from all of the archeology done in Egypt (and there’s been a lot) that even acknowledges the existance of the Jews was known to them. Funny not more a single record exists. We know how much it cost to have laundry done or a letter written, but no indication the Jews were ever there. Even better…those same excavations from above? No Hebrew ever found at any of these sites. Odd, isn’t it? There’s lots of hidden “grafitti” found all over the place, but not a one in Hebrew. If the people building these tombs were Jewish slaves, then why did they write, in Egyptian, how proud they were to be doing so? It’s almost like there’s no contemporary confirmation of the Judeo-Christian bible. Could it be…oh, I dunno…that it’s all made up?
>> If you could not see something so simple as God having to send Death in this form to Egypt there is no hope of you understanding the other passages.
This is supposedly a god who created the heavens and Earth. A god who created the entirety of the universe. A god who set the laws of nature into motion…he couldn’t think of any other way to get his people out of there? Couldn’t he have just teleported them all, lock stock and barrel, back home? You’re right, too showy. Hmmmm…Oh, I know…kill pharaoh? Sure, another one would be brought up, but you just kill him, too. Eventually, one of them’s going to figure out it’s a job with a severely shortened lifespan and just let the folks go to save his own skin. At most, you have to kill 2-3 adult males who are refusing to release slaves (although doing so against his will). Isn’t that better than killing thousands of innocent children?
Or, better yet: don’t harden the pharaoh’s heart so he might CONSIDER the offer, at least! If you can’t understand why killing thousands of children was probably not the best course of action, you have no hope of understanding why your religion is so very flawed.
>> People like mikespeir give people like me a bad name.
No, you do a really good job all on your own.
I know God loves me. And no, my roots in my belief, in fact, are not even close to being solely just because the Bible tells me so. Mathematically perfect things.(your Q to insult me)
Exo 14:17-18 “I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians so that they will go in after them. And I will gain glory through Pharaoh and all his army”.
This all plays into his perfect plan. God hardened Pharaohs heart to show the Israelites how much he would help them, how much he loved them. Put yourself into an Isrealis shoes, he was making a grand gesture to give perspective in loo of things to come. Israel is/was his chosen people, so he had to forge a history. He needed to clear a path, in order to give the Isrealite no excuse for what they where about to do. The Isrealite perspective is key to an understanding. He is out to teach Israel for the sake of the world to come.(your Q to insult me)
Are you trying to say the pyramids of Egypt not a monument to the glory(aka:pride) of the pharaohs? Even if these so called “free people” built them would that not be because of there grate pride(giving glory to pharaoh) in the pharaohs power. I’m talking about the pride of Egypt, king and subjects alike. He doesn’t do all this for the benefit of Egypt only for Israel, he playing favorites. Why was God playing favorites? The answer…… (Its a good one)(o-ya, your Q to be insulting then justify)
So why didn’t God just make it easy for Israel to be free from Egypt? Have you read the Torah? He cares about Israel, His “choose people” and did what was best for them for them. It’s very easy to spoil a child…(…….aaannndddd…Q)
About the argument that there is only one peace of evidence proving the biblical story. You should research Mount Sinai. If the Bible was just BS’n there would be no alter at the bottom to the exact specifications and architecture as described in the Bible. Also they found and authenticated the footage of the exact rock Moses struck, cracking the rock in half releasing vast amounts of water to satisfy 3,000,000 people and livestock. You can see the rock on Google Earth…. Guess what Saudi Arabia, you failed!!!!(It would be hard to insult this but if you try hard enough, I know you can do it…Q…)
I haven’t got the time to go through all of this right now, but on this alone I can assure you that you are the most hopelessly gullible person we’ve had on this site for ages. Absolutely hopelessly gullible. The Bible really is just BS, and I’ll try and get round to posting as many of the blatant contradictions and unsubstantiated claims as soon as – but given my computer’s knackered, and there’s barely a true or substantiated sentence in the whole fucking book, it’s going to take some time…
(P.S. To save us all some time – read some of Bart Ehrman’s books.)
Casey;
It’s interesting Your highlight of the story of the Pharaoh and the “First Born” as it is a great representation for a theme that we see quite often in the Bible, in fact, it might be called a cardinal tennet of Christianity. That is, the punishment of the innocent for trangressions by others.
Honestly;
Exodus 11:5
“Every firstborn son in Egypt will die, from the firstborn son of Pharaoh, who sits on the throne, to the firstborn son of the slave girl, who is at her hand mill, and all the firstborn of the cattle as well.”
This punishment of the Pharaoh is rendered right down the line of innocents to the very animals in the stable.
Worse yet, is that God hypnotised the Pharaoh not to comply with any of Moses’ pleas.
Of course, each Israelite family had to kill a lamb and use the blood to mark the doorway so the death angel would “Passover” their house without killing their own first born son.
This brings up another point; Killing animals to “Atone” for YOUR sins. Again, the responsibility is shifted onto another innocent party.
The examples are numerous; Adam makes one mistake, commits a sin. Now, ALL humanity bears the responsibility of this transgression.
In Noah’s time, God saw the evil in the hearts of men. So, he found it necessary to kill every living thing on the earth; (save Noah and family), this included toddlers, pregnant women and innocent animals.
We cannot exclude Jesus, another 3rd party, who’s main purpose was to serve as the attonement for everyone else’s sins.
Before we leave the topic of the first born;
According to Numbers 18:15 God says All firstborn belong to him.
“Sanctify unto me all the firstborn, whatsoever openeth the womb among the children of Israel, [both] of man and of beast: it [is] mine.”
…”16When they are a month old, you must redeem them at the redemption price set at five shekelsb of silver”
At which point do we ask ourselves, is this the ethics of a superior being?
Or is it the ethics of primative tribesmen trying to explain their harsh world ?
“In my view, God is the only one who can judge truthfully. Some of these passages you have little context on whats being said.”
Casey, there is no context that makes the killing of the men and the non-virgin women justified. In the next part of Numbers 31, God goes on to talk about saving the virgin girls for yourselves. Nothing can justify the killing nor the obvious command to make them sex-slaves (immediately or later).
It may well be that you don’t like to think about what the god in the bible told his people to do, but it’s there in black and white. Read it and think about it. God is not a nice person. Seriously – read the bible.
Redirected made the point about Adam’s one mistake being held against all his descendants. But there was one exception, wasn’t there? God somehow took that away from Mary, so she would not pass it on to Jesus, so he could be perfect. If God can do that for her, why not for us?
Meant as a response to Casey…
You’re right Len;
God did make some exceptions, but I think even more than Mary.
The following people were found “perfect”, “righteous” and or “blameless” in the sight of the Lord.
Noah; Gen. 7:1
Job; Job 1:8
Zacharias and Elisabeth; Luke 1:5-6
The rest of us are wicked.